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Since the Transcript for the trial came out the other day, I've tried to discover where JKR found the definition of the word "alohomora," just to satisfy my curiousity. The author said in court:

A. I think that it is sloppy, I think there is very little
4 research, and I don't think that it -- I don't think it
5 constitutes an original work.
6 Q. You mentioned that the Lexicon occasionally -- earlier that
7 the Lexicon occasionally contained etymologies.
8 A. Yes.
9 Q. I believe you also mentioned that the some of those
10 etymologies were wrong?
11 A. Hmm-hmm.
12 Q. Could you give the Court an example.
13 A. I could give several. But Mr. Vander Ark gives an
14 etymology for alohomora, which is an incantation used within
15 the Harry Potter books to open a locked door by magic. And he
16 asserts that this word was derived from the Hawaiian aloha
17 meaning good-bye. Which is errant nonsense. Alohomora is a
18 Sidiki word from West Africa, and it is a term used in
19 geomancy. It is a figure -- the figure alohomora means in
20 Sidiki "favorable to thieves."
Which is obviously a very
21 appropriate meaning for a spell that enables you to unlock a
22 locked door by magic.


That's all very interesting, but is it realistic that someone could find that on the Internet without the use of some obscure source? Steve used "Aloha" as the etymological source, the Hawaiian word for both "good-bye" and "hello," which makes sense when dealing with opening doors. I always thought that was the root word for Alohomora until reading in the news that the writer had a different view. 

I disagree that this is "sloppy research" though, and my own experience in trying to go on a quest for alohomoro is probably typical. I invite anyone who can actually find this root word to please post it here and tell me where they found it, or if anyone else is searching, let us know if you came closer than I did.  

UPDATE: Ding Ding and Ta Da!!!  We have a winner!  An anonymous, but very lucky researcher discovered the source for Alohomora! And her name is "Marielle."  Also thanks to [info]sander123 and [info]sciencegeek for following soon after.

Whoo-Hoo! So here's the Magic Link: http://www.serenapowers.com/sikidy.html

And another, which says "See Aloha" - *lol* : http://www.mysteryarts.com/magic/words/Ed.3/?p=115

As you see, you have to spell it "Sikidy" instead of "Sidiky."  That is probably a court transcription error.  Sikidy is not a dialect but a type of divination used on the Island of Madagascar. I had seen some links leading to that yesterday while researching Geomancy, but dismissed them because . . . that is East Africa, not West Africa. So even with the supposed location of the name origin, this was a challenge to unravel just from what the author said.  I don't know why "alohomora" doesn't show up on Search Engines from that website - it's odd, but I just searched for it again, and got nothing except references to the HP books. Anyway, this has been alot of fun and thanks to all who did the research!

Madagascar_map.jpg picture by sip44



*********************

First of all, I can't find any dialect called "Sidiki." I can find people with the name Sidiki, such as Sidiki Conde a West African dancer from Guinea. This actually gave me hope that I might find something, but that actually didn't happen, as you will see . . .

When I searched for Geomancy, something I know nothing about, I discovered that it's a type of divination which uses drawings in the sand or dots on a piece of paper, sort of like automatic writing. Some of it is done by poking sticks into the ground. I found two sites that were quite intensive:

The Magickal Use of the Sixteen Figures of Geomancy has some familiar words - Caput Draconis, Albus, Rubeus, and Fortuna Major - along with divination figures. But no "alohomora."

The Mantalogue has nearly every single historical reference to Geomancy throughout recorded history. Talk about etymology! You can wallow in sources there, from Agrippa and Paracelsus through Rabelais. But no mention of "alohomora." Perhaps you could look through all those works and see if the word appears, but having read Agrippa and Paracelsus in the past, that is slow going, and I just need this one word.

So moving on . . . I remembered a reference dictionary I have used before by Madame H. P. Blavatsky, which is the source for the name "Cassandra Blavatsky" in the books, who wrote "Unfogging the Future." (Her initials also remind me of the HBP, though switched around). 

I recalled that in the Theosophical Glossary I had found such phrases as "Abracadabra" (source of Avada Kedavra) as well as "Abraxas" which is Draco Malfoy's grandfather's name. I'll post those definitions here, to show you how detailed most of them are, although the Abracadabra disagrees with JKR's own source for "Avada Kedavra" somewhat. She said it is Aramaic, and I guess that's close to Coptic Egyptian, but it was never a killing spell:

Abracadabra (Gn.). This symbolic word first occurs in a medical treatise in verse by Samonicus, who flourished in the reign of the Emperor Septimus Seveus. Godfrey Higgins says it is from Abra or Abar “God”, in Celtic, and cad ‘‘holy” ; it was used as a charm, and engraved on Kameas as an amulet. [w.w.w.]

Godfrey Higgins was nearly right, as the word “Abracadabra” is a later corruption of the sacred Gnostic term “Abrasax”, the latter itself being a still earlier corruption of a sacred and ancient Coptic or Egyptian word: a magic formula which meant in its symbolism ‘‘Hurt me not”, and addressed the deity in its hieroglyphics as “Father”. It was generally attached to an amulet or charm and worn as a Tat (q.v.), on the breast under the garments.

Abraxas or Abrasax (Gn.). Mystic words which have been traced as far back as Basilides, the Pythagorean, of Alexandria, AD. 90. He uses Abraxas as a title for Divinity, the supreme of Seven, and as having 365 virtues. In Greek numeration, a. 1, b. 2, r. 100, a. I, x 60, a. I, s. 200 = 365 days of the year, solar year, a cycle of divine action. C. W. King, author of The Gnostics, considers the word similar to the Hebrew Shemhamphorasch, a holy word, the extended name of God. An Abraxas Gem usually shows a man’s body with the head of a cock, one arm with a shield, the other with a whip.


But guess what? There is no "alohomora" there listed along with those words. I searched to see how many types of divination are listed, and there are quite a few, but Geomancy is not listed there either, except that casting lots of any kind was frowned upon by St. Augustine.

Moving on . . . I took a different tack and decided to look for just parts of words. I found nothing when searching for "Aloho" alone, except a Wikipedia biography of Ignatius Abded Aloho II, a Syrian Monk who was the 118th successor to St. Peter in Antioch. I don't see what that has to do with a spell for opening doors.

Next . . . I searched for "moro" alone. That led to this: the Mora Moro a type of West-African fish that feeds on crustaceans and garbage! Voila! At least I was getting closer to West Africa, though still off the coast!

But what a fish has to do with opening doors or geomancy, I'm not sure.

So after an hour of this futile searching, I impatiently typed in "hello goodbye africa" and came up with a familiar word: "Shalom." Like "Aloha," Shalom in Hebrew means both hello and good-bye, but also "peace" and "good luck." And at least it does come from the continent of Africa, though the northern part instead of the western part. 

Edited to Add: I'm not Jewish, and I hope my Jewish friends will forgive me if I mistranslate, but according to the Jewish Day School of Metropolitan Seattle, Washington:

". . . teachers are addressed with the title "HaMorah" (feminine) or "HaMoreh" (masculine) followed by the teacher's first name."

So I was really close in my original essay - "alohomora" might sound alot like "Shalom HaMorah," which would mean "Good Morning Teacher" or "Hello, Teacher."

You can look at that metaphorically - a teacher "opens the doors of learning."

                                         

I realize this is so far-fetched, and yet, it's as good a guess as "Aloha," which I think is also closer to the the word than anything I've found in the past three days.
  See the comments below - I've been through everything from Cornelius Agrippa, to the Etruscan Goddesses, to Washington Irving's "Al Hambra" (From "El Hamra," the "red castle" of the Moors in Spain).  

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


If JKR hates the Hawaiian "Aloha" connotation, she can always change it to "Shalomhomora." But that is really stretching this as far as I possibly can, and for those reading this with no sense of humor, I'm just being facetious and mean no harm to anyone who speaks Hebrew. 

The bottom line is, I couldn't find a source for "alohomora," and I've talked to quite a few well-educated people in the past few days who also cannot find it. Obviously, JKR could have found it from an obscure anthropology or magic book from her own "restricted section." Often old books contain material that never makes it onto the Internet.

But this business of criticizing intelligent researchers because they make a mistake and connect it to a more obvious word doesn't seem quite fair. 

  

Comments

[info]mary_j_59 wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 02:43 am (UTC)
I agree with you. I just checked the Oxford dictionary, which I have installed on my computer, and none of these terms appear there. There is also no reference to the Sidiki people in the Brittanica; there's only a footnote on Burkina Faso. In any case, the derivation from "aloha" is at least as reasonable as the one Rowling gives.

And, though it's perhaps a bit meanspirited of me, I am not sure what right she has to call anyone sloppy given the massive inconsistencies in the book she wrote.
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 03:03 am (UTC)
JKR has mentioned Burkina Faso once in an interview, when she was talking about her days working for Amnesty International. So perhaps she did research back then - I don't know. However, the word "alohomora" is not online anywhere that I can find except in the context of the HP books. So it is not "errant nonsense" is someone can't find the West African word.

Speaking of inconsistencies:
One thing I realized today, with help from some people who translated, was that Dale Cendali used the word "flints" to describe the inconsistancies in the books which Steve points out in the Lexicon. That is because Marcus Flint would have been in school for 8 years instead of 7 the way he is mentioned in the books.

My good friend Hwyla wrote today about Bellatrix, who is also a Flint:
I was once a proponent of the idea that Bella was one of the eldest in her year and that her last year was Sev's first - in fact, I think I was very vocal about it and how I though that surely with plenty of time while writing the books she could get the dates correct. That her math only suffered when under duress of interview. However that has been destroyed now that JKR says Snape and the Marauders began Hogwarts in 1971 (based on the dates on the Potters' headstone).The Black Family Tapestry has Bella born in 1951 - nine years earlier, at best eight years - so they couldn't even have crossed years at Hogwarts unless Bella was kept behind TWICE.
So, that would be a 'flint' now, when it wasn't before.
[info]mary_j_59 wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 04:01 am (UTC)
Yes, again, about the Flints! I'm actually starting to wonder if one of the things that causes Rowling to claim the Lexicon is "sloppy" is that it does point out her Flints. ;)

And Bellatrix is definitely one of them. There is simply no way she could have been in school with Severus, and yet I think the text implies that she was.
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 05:12 am (UTC)
Well, Sirius implies in GoF that Snape ran with a Slytherin crowd including Bellatrix and her husband, a married couple. He says Snape was "always a little dark arts oddball" and implies that the "crowd" was with him in school. But Snape was only eleven when Bella was 20 and probably already married. *eyeroll* So Sirius was either extremely wrong (which I have always believed) or JKR messed up the dates on the Black Family Tree (also possible).
[info]hp_lexicon wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 08:01 am (UTC)
Another possiblity is that Snape was in the same 'crowd', as in a group of particularly Dark-Artsy Slytherins, but not at the same time. Sort of like a school club for the Dark Arts that existed over quite a few years. Both were part of it, but Bella had left school by the time Snape was there.

But yeah, it's probabaly a mistake on the Black Family Tree. I believe she also intended to have the Potters that are on there be James' parents, but forgot what she'd said about them in an interview.

Steve
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 09:14 am (UTC)
About the Slytherins - maybe Sirius is just supposed to be mixed up because he's been in prison so long. He lives in the past alot, and he may be getting Snape as a boy and Snape as an adult mixed up in his mind. We know he hated Bellatrix as a child himself, so even if he only saw Snape with the Lestranges once it would be guilt by association. But clearly, Snape was friends with the Malfoys. So I think Sirius is just lumping them all together, even though he had never thought Snape was a Death Eater.
[info]spirit_serpenti wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 11:15 am (UTC)
I believe you are probably both correct. Bella, the Lestrange brothers and Lucius probably were the "first wave" of the whole gang, with only Lucius being young enough to have met Snape at school. Although it's hard for me to imagine Bella and Lucius as being too chummy.:D

Snape may have been seen around Bella & husband when he was hanging out with Lucius. Lucius may have started dating Narcissa while they were still at school, and Bella is Narcissa's sister after all. If Narcissa and Lucius married straight out of school its possible that both Snape and Sirius (who hadn't run away from home yet) attended the engagement and/or wedding.
(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 01:50 pm (UTC)
We got nothing, either
Thanks for posting this, SIP. Several of us have been trying to track this down since we heard about that, and so far we have nothing. Sidiki isn't even a West African language; the closest anyone got was a Bantu language called Sizaki. Sidiki is, however, a popular surname.

As for Alohamora being a geomantic term...um, I don't think so. As anyone who knows me knows, I have read countless--in the hundreds--of texts, both online and in print--dealing with geomancy and other occult subjects. I don't recall EVER seeing that term used anywhere except in Harry Potter. I really think that if I had, it would have made light bulbs flash on in my head and I'd hear "ding ding ding." In fact, when you do a Google search, you get a total of five results. Two are HP, one is the Webster's Online Dictionary which links to a page that deals specifically with spells in Harry Potter (no mention of alohamora in connection with geomancy), a fourth link is broken and the fifth is a YouTube video that has nothing to do with nothing. LOL

SIP, your etymology is as good a guess as any. So, did JKR lie to make Steve look bad or does she just not know what she's talking about? She had to know that we'd go searching for this, right?

Now, I don't expect a Sizaki-English dictionary to show up online, nor do I expect to be able to walk into B&N and buy one. And in fact, even at Amazon only 6 results show for Sizaki, none of which is a dictionary.

The sad part is that Wikipedia has already updated its entry to include this information, obviously without verifying whether or not the information is correct.
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 05:08 pm (UTC)
Re: We got nothing, either
Thanks, Kristin - saw your name in the post below. :)

There are only so many ways you can do research into these spell words. The Latin resources online are pretty good, and most of the Latinate roots are also in the dictionary. But this word is not Latinate. Even knowing the West African background isn't helpful, because most Geomancy sites seem to have nothing to do with the word, as you say.

I just scanned through each page of Gerard Cremonensis' "On Astronomical Geomancy - which I do not reccommend because it is deadly dull and doesn't have any interesting language in it at all.

Then I went through Cornelius Agrippa of Nettesheim's Occult Philosophy and while Geomancy is mentioned, "alohomora" is not there. Nothing about opening doors of any kind.

I'm not just trying to be thick-headed about this. If it is out there in some obscure text, that is great! I'd love to be the one to track it down.

But again, the source may not be available to me, or to anyone on the Lexicon staff either. So criticism of research is not fair if it's such an obscure word connection.
(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 01:52 pm (UTC)
We got nothing, either
Forgot to sign my name to the above post. I'm Kristin.
[info]mary_j_59 wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 02:07 pm (UTC)
Just another thought, based on what all of us didn't find: I hope Steve's lawyer raised an objection here, so that everything we *didn't* find can be brought up on appeal.

But I still think it would be better if Rowling had never sued in the first place.
(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 02:33 pm (UTC)
Mary J 59, I read the transcripts and he did not raise an objection. Why should he? He's just as clueless about the etymology as we are. He probably took it for granted that she's the author and she knows what she's talking about.

I really hope the Lexicon hasn't been updated yet. I don't want them to look foolish until this is verified by someone.

(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 02:34 pm (UTC)
Darn it!
Forgot to sign my name again. LOL
(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 02:55 pm (UTC)
Well, it's not West African...
I found this:

http://www.ravenswing.com/~keys/independent/independent_index.html

There is a character called Amora (which is a Jewish term, by the way) who is the goddess of luck and thieves. It's from an RPG called the Key Game.

I seriously doubt that's where it came from or if that's even a root term, but hey, it's about all there is.

Kristin (who remembered to sign her name this time!)
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 05:31 pm (UTC)
Re: Well, it's not West African...
Re: Well, it's not West African...
Well, that's a little closer, so maybe I was right in thinking this might turn out to be Hebrew in nature instead of West African.

The goddess of Luck in Roman mythology is Fortuna - which reminds me of "Fortuna Major" in regular Geomancy.

The goddess of Thieves is Furrina, whose name may be connected to the Furies:

" . . . the similar Latin words are furina, "thief", or "robber"; furtum, "theft"; furtim, "stealthily"; and furax, "thievish" (these words are also at the root of the English furtive, meaning "stealthy" or "thief-like"). Accordingly, some authorities consider Her a Goddess of Thieves or Bandits, much like Laverna. These Latin words, oddly enough, are also related to terms pertaining to bees and bee-keeping; furina can also be used of "robber bees", or bees who steal honey from colonies not their own, usually if there is insufficient nectar to be found out in the fields at the time; and forina (an alternate spelling of Furrina) can refer to a cell of bees. What Furrina might have to do with bees, however, is not known."

No alohomora there, but interesting.

Lavernais another Etruscan/Roman goddess of Thieves:

"Originally an Underworld goddess of the Etruscans, Laverna became goddess of thieves because thieves operate in darkness. Her name is said to derive either from the Latin latere ("to lurk"), or levare ("to relieve, lessen or lighten", something pickpockets certainly do) and levator ("a thief")."

I realize I'm getting far afield from my search for Alohomora, but I want to cover all the bases. I'm going to look through the Etruscan goddesses.
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 05:41 pm (UTC)
Re: Well, it's not West African...
I'm also wondering if this is a word dropped somewhere in Sir Richard Burton's Arabian Nights? (Hundreds of pages long, and I don't have time to read much of it.)
Links:
http://www.isidore-of-seville.com/burton/3.html
http://mfx.dasburo.com/an/a_index_commented.html
(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 06:06 pm (UTC)
Re: Well, it's not West African...
[i]The goddess of Luck in Roman mythology is Fortuna - which reminds me of "Fortuna Major" in regular Geomancy.[/i]

Well, "fortuna" is Latin AND Spanish for "fortune". The Fortuna Major represents the best case scenario for all events and means prosperous beginnings.

"Hamora" is a Hebrew girls' name.

The only thing I can come up with for "aloh" is that it's aluminum hydroxide. LOL There is, of course, the root [i]amor[/i], which is Latin for "love."

Kristin
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 06:26 pm (UTC)
Re: Well, it's not West African...
I didn't think about "amor" - I guess if someone "loved opening doors" that might be just the right word.

*rotfl*

Hamora - Here's a translation using the spelling "hamorah" - not sure of the meaning, but it has something to do with teachers and blackboards.


Here's an intriguing one - how about "Alhambra" like the castle in Spain? From "Kalet Al Hamrah" - that almost sounds like "alohomora."

http://www.xs4all.nl/~josvg/cits/sb/sb1105.html

"Alhambra" comes from the arabic "Kelet al Hamrah", meaning "the red castle". It is named after the red bricks of which it is made: the Alhambra is the former pleasure-castle of the Moorish Nasriden royalty of Granada (1231-1491). It is a grand monument of Arabic architecture en is situated in a lovely region on the top of a completely overgrown mountain, near Granada, from which it is separated by the valley of the river Darro.
In the age of the Moors this castle had a magnificent household and guards of 10,000 men and in the last battle against the Christians it was defended by 40,000 Muslims. After the Moors were driven from Spain (1492) the castle was the home of the Castilian royalty for some time. King Charles V destroyed part of the castle and wanted to replace it by a palace, which has remained unfinished. The last royalty living n Alhambra were King Filipa V and his wife, at the beginning of the 19th century. In the second half of that century the castles abandond rooms became uninhabitable and some time later parts of it fell to ruins. Intact are still the living quarters and representative rooms grouped around two courtyards.


That led me to Washington Irving's book The Alhambra" - I haven't read it, but one of the chapters is called The Mysterious Chambers. *lol* But sadly, the narrator has a key and doesn't need a spell. So that's a dead end so far.



[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 06:42 pm (UTC)
Re: Well, it's not West African...
OK, I'm not Jewish, and I hope my Jewish friends will forgive me if I mistranslate, but according to the Jewish Day School of Metropolitan Seattle, Washington:

". . . teachers are addressed with the title "HaMorah" (feminine) or "HaMoreh" (masculine) followed by the teacher's first name."

So I was really close in my original essay - "alohomora" might sound alot like "Shalom HaMorah," which would mean "Good Morning Teacher" or "Hello, Teacher."

You can look at that metaphorically - a teacher "opens the doors of learning."



I realize this is so far-fetched, and yet, it's as good a guess as "Aloha," which I think is also closer to the the word than anything I've found in the past three days.



(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 09:54 pm (UTC)
Re: Well, it's not West African...
Except that it is a fantasy world...not a real world and so the author may decide right?
[info]bemoan1000 wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 03:34 pm (UTC)
But this business of criticizing intelligent researchers because they make a mistake and connect it to a more obvious word doesn't seem quite fair.
I agree also. It doesn’t to me either. The whole point of reading fiction is that each reader has their own interpretation; they bring their own world. We bring what we know or what we find. We think.

I have a feeling with the Scottish book that there will be more inconsistencies and/or more confusion. I could be wrong, but just looking at the word Alohomora or even the Black family tree is doing makes me think it will.

“Sloppy research” I think that is mean-spirited.I think she might have been guilty of it herself. I believe that in one of her interviews she said that Lily’s patronus was a doe because James’s animagius was a stag. Someone pointed out in an essay that does don’t mate with stags they mate with bucks.
Deer, buck, doe, fawn
Deer, stag, hind, fawn

http://in.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080120054831AAf4qPa
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 05:14 pm (UTC)
I don't really know the difference between a buck and a stag - those are both male deer, I guess. A "hart" is also a stag, and so is a "roebuck." A "hind" is the female doe, but she couldn't use that word because it's just too weird! *lol*

Honestly, the more I think about the Patronus mess, the more I wish that Harry's had also been a doe, because JKR has made such a big deal that Lily's sacrifice was greater than James's sacrifice. Lily set up the entire story, but her child sees James as his protector. No wonder Snape thinks Harry is an ungrateful child, especially after Book Three!!! And really, that stag patronus appears after Harry hears all the stories about the Marauders in the Shrieking Shack, so it's true that Harry is glorifying his father instead of his mother.

I really want her to explain what James's patronus was. Also a doe?
[info]bemoan1000 wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 05:48 pm (UTC)
They are both deer but different species. I personally don’t want to hear anymore of her explanations; I think is fun to do it myself or hear what others think. I see the patronus as the one that chooses the person. I always think of Harry’s stag as James looking out for his son. It personally gives it more meaning for me.


[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 06:53 pm (UTC)
I think that's a great way of looking at it! :)

Other people have said that the Stag is not James the "pater" at all, but Harry's expression of his inner self.

For Snape, the doe represents his love for Lily.

For Mr. Weasley, the weasel represents his love for family.

Hermione's "otter" represents her love for Ron from Ottery St. Catchpole, but also, Harry P'otter.

Luna's "hare" would represent her inner "moon goddess" but also her love for "Hare-y". *lol*

That's the way I see it.
(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 05:57 pm (UTC)
I agree with you all. I too did a lot of research on various esoteric sites before the last book came out. I know I didn't read much on geomancy, because it is boring as hell. But I agree with one of the previous poster If I had seen alohomora written anywhere I too would have heard a big ding ding ding in my head.

Still all this made me do some search too and I was able to find this.
http://www.serenapowers.com/sikidy.html
It seems to be the only "source" sort of speak though


(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 06:11 pm (UTC)
Sidiky
Well, ding ding, I think we might have a winner. Didn't occur to me that Sidiky (notice the spelling, which could have been a mistranslation on the court reporter's part)was the actual name of the particular version of geomancy--I'd never heard of it.

Madagascar isn't in West Africa, though.
(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 06:13 pm (UTC)
Sidiky
Well, ding ding, I think we might have a winner. Great job!That's about as close as we're going to get, I think. Didn't occur to me that Sidiky (notice the spelling, which could have been a mistranslation on the court reporter's part)was the actual name of the particular version of geomancy--I'd never heard of it. Didn't study African geomancy, only Western and Chinese.

Madagascar isn't in West Africa, though. She was way off base on that and the language, which would be Malagasy.

Kristin
(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 06:16 pm (UTC)
Sidiky
How did you find that? I typed in "Sidiky" "geomancy" and got nothing. I had to type in Madagascar specifically before anything came up and even then I only got 3 results.
(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 06:51 pm (UTC)
LOL I did so many search before getting anything too. I used madagascar geomancy to find that one. By the way from another site it says Sidiky is the grain they used to do the divination.

In any case I think we can easily claim that it is almost impossible to find that information on the net, even if we know about it. So I think we can positively say that it is an impossible information to find on the net if we don't know anything about. It is, in my opinion, impossible to even stumble on madagascar geomancy by accident when searching for geomancy and divination. There are no way we could have find this if she hadn't told us!
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 07:02 pm (UTC)
Whoo-Hoo! So that's the Magic Link:

http://www.serenapowers.com/sikidy.html

Who found that by the way? I want to give you credit in my post up above. You can give a fake name if you like, haha, but I still want to thank you for finding the answer. This has been alot of fun for me, and I hope for anyone reading this. :)

Ta da!

"ALOHOMORA or ALAHAMORA
(Albus/White)
The diviner, the crowd, heartbreak, favourable to thieves."

I saw Madagascar when I was looking around also, but I didn't pursue it because as others have said it's in the Indian Ocean, and that's East Africa.

Map!



(Anonymous) wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 07:48 pm (UTC)
I am the guilty culprit who knows nothing about geography! Sorry don't post much outside the forum and I am not used to signing my post when just posting. It is Marielle.

I totally didn' even bother to verify where Madagascar is. *Gosh, Thta was so stupid of me. I was just so happy to finally have found something. The problem to me is that since this is the only source, well how reliable is it supposed to be? believe me I did a lot of search, even in french and I really couldn't come with anything better!

Marielle
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 26th, 2008 02:12 am (UTC)
Thanks, Marielle - I will give you credit up in the main essay for being the first to find it! And well-done!

(no subject) - [info] - Apr. 25th, 2008 07:13 pm (UTC) Expand
(no subject) - [info] - Apr. 25th, 2008 07:14 pm (UTC) Expand
(no subject) - [info] - Apr. 25th, 2008 07:23 pm (UTC) Expand
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 25th, 2008 07:38 pm (UTC)
Sander, even if you are late, you are doing better than I did!

I was mainly trying to search for "alohomora" and not so much the word "Sidiky" or whatever it is. *lol* I should have pursued that direction.

Cool set of books!
[info]sciencegeek wrote:
Apr. 26th, 2008 01:01 am (UTC)
so...er...finally? It's a good thing I have a Sikidy to English dictionary for when I read Harry Potter, or I'd never know this.
/sarcasm

http://www.serenapowers.com/sikidy.html

http://www.mysteryarts.com/magic/words/Ed.3/?p=115

Aw, already found. But still. How much searching did this take? If Steve only looked up Alohomora, no wonder he didn't find her etymological root. And uh, from what JKR says, it sounds like it should be a language, but it's not - it's a type of divination.

Edited at 2008-04-26 01:07 am (UTC)
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 26th, 2008 02:10 am (UTC)
It's funny that on that the site mysteryarts.com it says "See Aloha" on the entry. *lol* That really makes my day.

And I don't think I'll ever have a Sidiky dictionary in my home, either, haha. But like you, I thought it was a dialect, not a type of magic.

[info]aredwitch wrote:
Apr. 26th, 2008 02:17 pm (UTC)
Way to go Marielle!! I am impressed. I am still slogging my way through the transcripts and I was going to go back to that when I was done but now I don't have to. Yay!
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 26th, 2008 11:04 pm (UTC)
Yes, she did a great job, and the mystery is solved, but JKR didn't exactly lead the way with her information.
[info]aredwitch wrote:
Apr. 27th, 2008 01:09 pm (UTC)
No, and they make a big deal about the Latin in the spells. Yeah the Lexicon took homo-inis from a dictionary without realizing that the' inis' is the genitive ending of the word but nobody mentioned that Rowling spelled homenum wrong anyway. It appears to be the accusative form of 'homo' judging by the fact it ends with an 'm' but homo is a third declension noun and the proper ending should be 'em'. As well she changed the second 'i' to an 'e'. It should have been spelled 'hominem'. Small wonder Steve makes mistakes when the author makes no effort to be accurate.
[info]rattlesnakeroot wrote:
Apr. 28th, 2008 11:51 am (UTC)
The problem is that JKR used to say that her Latin was supposed to be odd and mixed with English, only then she decided to attack the Lexicon for not translating it in a scholarly way. But I learned a long time ago from my friend [info]janus_incantus that most of those Latinate words are misspelled or in the wrong tense or something (I never studied Latin, as you can probably tell). There is nothing wrong with making up words that are incorrect usage, but she shouldn't turn around attack someone in court for not being able to translate them perfectly.

And I was thinking about "alohomora" yesterday, and it came to me that there is no reason we would assume that it was a complete word taken from real magic. Most of the words are combinations and compound words, so the trend would be that each part of the word would be found separately, leading to "Aloha" and "Homora" or "Mora." That is how the vast majority of words are set up in the books, and someone would have to be a Legillimens to know otherwise, especially when the word is so hard to find.

I just learned that "homora" is a type of Moth species that infests coffee plants. :) There are a million ways to mistranslate "alohomora."
[info]aredwitch wrote:
Apr. 29th, 2008 01:03 pm (UTC)
I noticed on Marielle's page is also the equally elusive alihosty.
alihotsy, from "the same source which is also from Western Africa. And it means lightness of spirit. I used that word for a bush, the leaves of which causes hysteria"
At least she was not outright making stuff up on the stand.
[info]kamion wrote:
May. 2nd, 2008 10:28 am (UTC)
Good, you got the link to that spell, I too searched for Sidiki and got nothing but given names, who were btw mainly West-African. JKR should better get her geographics right before she sprouts snidy remarks.
And realise there are at least a dosen fans around who jump on it to search for the source.
She could have just sent an E-mail to the Lexicon when it bothered her that the source was wrong
(no subject) - miadurango - Jun. 16th, 2008 06:47 pm (UTC) Expand